Movie #8 On Body and Soul
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NurseRatched
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Ok, well that question has been answered! Thanks for following up on it. I plan to watch the video you've posted later tonight..
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Lori
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I see it too! He has a deep countenance and carriage. An excellent choice for sure!Dee wrote: ↑Fri Mar 02, 2018 12:42 pmThe director has described Géza Morcsányi as someone who looks like a wise Indian chief.
I totally get that. It's all in his eyes.
I've found this interview with him from 5 years ago. Just move the cursor somewhere in the middle and take a quick look at him with a long pony tail. That's an Indian Chief. Definitely.
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NurseRatched
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Smiley eyes...I can never resist 
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NurseRatched
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Moonchime
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Ok so I'm a bit late but I was always taught it was a case of better late than never - this may of course be the exception.
I really enjoyed this film and went into it as Dee had advised completely "blind". In fact it was a bit worse than that because I wasn't even sure of the title until I had checked it on here having started watching it without subtitles (it takes a while before you realise)
I have relished reading all your comments and am still mulling over many of them but to start with I will give my most spontaneous reactions. Thank you all of you for giving me so much food for thought.
The beginning of the film held me in a trance - I loved the stillness, the absorbing gentleness of those early frames with the views of the forest and hypnotic grace of the deer. We gaze at the sun in the sky, just as the animals do; just as the cows waiting at the abattoir do; moments that make us feel alive. The irony then, of what is to come.
The abattoir is the all too real setting and with the slaughter of the cattle is in total contrast to those scenes in the forest . I, personally, did not feel that it was gratuitous - I felt that it was an essential part of what the story explores; that which makes up body and soul and how sometimes it can be very difficult to tell between the two, to define what is of the spirit/soul and what is purely physical.
The scenes in the abattoir are not pleasant watching - but why, I wondered, were they so disturbing ? They could have been worse than they were - we see no obvious signs of distress or suffering. We see the cattle treated as carcasses, literally as meat - clinical and efficient - and yet it is that which is so upsetting...the very distant coldness of it. Is n't it because we feel that something more than the physical is being degraded? A dignity has been offended - a dignity that we feel in common? Something has been made lesser somehow - and even if we are the perpetrators - or maybe because we are - we are not immune.
Maria comes to the abattoir as an inspector, but she is not dis-similar to the cattle she assesses - in a world that casts her into situations she doesn't understand and at the mercy of others. Her very "otherliness" is what attracts her boss as she stands on her own while the others chatter and smoke.
She has a tension and awkwardness about her despite her confidence in what she does, having no idea of how to converse face to face in a natural manner. When she gets home she goes over or rehearses conversations using the cruet set or lego people. With the latter she prepares what she is going to say to Endre, but is unable to change the script when it turns out to be quite inappropriate.
Despite her intelligence she does not have the resources to cope with every day social interaction and intimacy and cannot read social situations.
The psychological assessments are, I agree, somewhat of an unusual device (at least I think they are) but I found them thoroughly entertaining. I loved the
confident but saucy assessor and found myself feeling just a little bit sorry for her by the end of the day. It was, though, a wonderful moment when we realise the deer are not incidental to the story but central to it; there is a connection that is beyond words, beyond the physical. Is this the "soul" that speaks?
It is a refreshing change to follow a love story that does not follow a standard path and where two people originally bond in a mind space rather than in a physical one. I think there is a tangible sense of loneliness in some of the shots taken in their respective homes creating a strong sense of misplacement and yet despite all the setbacks there is hope.
As others have already mentioned, the scenes in which Maria tries to connect with her sensuality were good to watch - particularly when she gets sprayed by the sprinklers and actually, at last, smiles with sheer pleasure in the moment.
It is a film of great variance and contrast - violence, beauty, loneliness, confusion and dark humour.
The scene where Maria is stuffing in gummy bears while watching porn was hilarious ,as well as more than a little ironic. However, when she feels that there is no longer any hope with Endre, the suicide scene did come as a shock to me and I found it very hard to watch; her calmness was unnerving even as her life poured itself out - a parallel to the cattle in the abattoir. Fortunately she got the phone call.
I also enjoyed some of the cameo parts - I think Dee has mentioned the cleaning lady- her character rang true for me - I have often had more conversations with cleaning staff than anyone else; they always seem to have a lot to say and always know unexpected things.
The HR manager also made me smile with his "you've got to keep a woman on a short leash" while being constantly requested by his wife to pick up the children and do a bit of shopping.
Last but not least I think the cinematography was vital in evoking feelings and creating a sense of place. When Endre and Maria are on the railway platform standing apart there is such a feeling of the vulnerability and smallness of the humans against the wonderful city backdrop.
I really enjoyed this film and went into it as Dee had advised completely "blind". In fact it was a bit worse than that because I wasn't even sure of the title until I had checked it on here having started watching it without subtitles (it takes a while before you realise)
I have relished reading all your comments and am still mulling over many of them but to start with I will give my most spontaneous reactions. Thank you all of you for giving me so much food for thought.
The beginning of the film held me in a trance - I loved the stillness, the absorbing gentleness of those early frames with the views of the forest and hypnotic grace of the deer. We gaze at the sun in the sky, just as the animals do; just as the cows waiting at the abattoir do; moments that make us feel alive. The irony then, of what is to come.
The abattoir is the all too real setting and with the slaughter of the cattle is in total contrast to those scenes in the forest . I, personally, did not feel that it was gratuitous - I felt that it was an essential part of what the story explores; that which makes up body and soul and how sometimes it can be very difficult to tell between the two, to define what is of the spirit/soul and what is purely physical.
The scenes in the abattoir are not pleasant watching - but why, I wondered, were they so disturbing ? They could have been worse than they were - we see no obvious signs of distress or suffering. We see the cattle treated as carcasses, literally as meat - clinical and efficient - and yet it is that which is so upsetting...the very distant coldness of it. Is n't it because we feel that something more than the physical is being degraded? A dignity has been offended - a dignity that we feel in common? Something has been made lesser somehow - and even if we are the perpetrators - or maybe because we are - we are not immune.
Maria comes to the abattoir as an inspector, but she is not dis-similar to the cattle she assesses - in a world that casts her into situations she doesn't understand and at the mercy of others. Her very "otherliness" is what attracts her boss as she stands on her own while the others chatter and smoke.
She has a tension and awkwardness about her despite her confidence in what she does, having no idea of how to converse face to face in a natural manner. When she gets home she goes over or rehearses conversations using the cruet set or lego people. With the latter she prepares what she is going to say to Endre, but is unable to change the script when it turns out to be quite inappropriate.
Despite her intelligence she does not have the resources to cope with every day social interaction and intimacy and cannot read social situations.
The psychological assessments are, I agree, somewhat of an unusual device (at least I think they are) but I found them thoroughly entertaining. I loved the
confident but saucy assessor and found myself feeling just a little bit sorry for her by the end of the day. It was, though, a wonderful moment when we realise the deer are not incidental to the story but central to it; there is a connection that is beyond words, beyond the physical. Is this the "soul" that speaks?
It is a refreshing change to follow a love story that does not follow a standard path and where two people originally bond in a mind space rather than in a physical one. I think there is a tangible sense of loneliness in some of the shots taken in their respective homes creating a strong sense of misplacement and yet despite all the setbacks there is hope.
As others have already mentioned, the scenes in which Maria tries to connect with her sensuality were good to watch - particularly when she gets sprayed by the sprinklers and actually, at last, smiles with sheer pleasure in the moment.
It is a film of great variance and contrast - violence, beauty, loneliness, confusion and dark humour.
The scene where Maria is stuffing in gummy bears while watching porn was hilarious ,as well as more than a little ironic. However, when she feels that there is no longer any hope with Endre, the suicide scene did come as a shock to me and I found it very hard to watch; her calmness was unnerving even as her life poured itself out - a parallel to the cattle in the abattoir. Fortunately she got the phone call.
I also enjoyed some of the cameo parts - I think Dee has mentioned the cleaning lady- her character rang true for me - I have often had more conversations with cleaning staff than anyone else; they always seem to have a lot to say and always know unexpected things.
The HR manager also made me smile with his "you've got to keep a woman on a short leash" while being constantly requested by his wife to pick up the children and do a bit of shopping.
Last but not least I think the cinematography was vital in evoking feelings and creating a sense of place. When Endre and Maria are on the railway platform standing apart there is such a feeling of the vulnerability and smallness of the humans against the wonderful city backdrop.
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Dee
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I'm delighted with this post, Mz Moonchime, so happy you've joined us, and even more that you have obviously enjoyed the film. Lovely to read your thougths and impressions, and getting a feeling for your taste in movies.
That screenshot you've included in your post, it's so atmospheric, it just washed all over me again. And your reminder of the almost stifling loneliness of the home scenes. Stifling - for us to watch, even more so because both Endre and Mária seemed to be so accepting of their situation at the beginning of the film.
It is so hard to come across fresh love stories this day and age, after everything we have seen and read... indeed, this was something utterly surprising.
We seem to have reacted very similarly to most of the film, so I'm going to focus on the section of your post where you speak of our uneasiness watching the butchering scenes. Like you, I've been thinking a lot about why it makes us so uncomfortable. You're wondering if it's the "very distant coldness" of dealing with the carcasses, "a dignity has been offended" and "something has been made lesser somehow". I think all of that is very true, and primarily because at a very elementary level we identify with the animal, a living thing one minute, a carcass the next. I think we are deeply reminded of how in death a creature immediately loses his agency. Anyone can do anything they want with the body. This complete loss of agency is horrendous to witness in an animal. It's part sympathy, part sobering facing of our own mortality. When we die, thankfully no one is going to eat us, but there are clear procedures in place, just as clinical as the butchering. If we're organ donors, bits get cut out of our bodies straight away and ferried to someone in need. If we die of unknown causes, there might be an autopsy in order. Then we are out in a freezer until it's decided what kind of funeral we'll have. Then the body needs to be prepared for the procedure. No matter how much respect people will show to the body in dealing with all this, it's going to be a well oiled clinical procedure, well practised, performed routinely.
And there is something very sad about that, because these bodies, animals or humans, were filled once with a consciousness, with life.
When Mária is going through her own procedure of distinguishing her consciousness, it's the most terrifying thing to witness. One thing to see it done to a cow, bad enough, but a person doing it to themselves, that just makes us all want to scream out loud in protest. And thank god this wasn't a story with an unhappy ending. I would have not recommended the film to you in that case. But it didn't feel like it was going there, it would have gone against the grain of the rest of the film. I remember grasping for any ideas how she might be saved, and the phone call was perfect.
The director hasn't made a feature film in near 20 years. Mz Peggy says her previous film was also wonderful. I will check if that's available anywhere online with English subtitles.
That screenshot you've included in your post, it's so atmospheric, it just washed all over me again. And your reminder of the almost stifling loneliness of the home scenes. Stifling - for us to watch, even more so because both Endre and Mária seemed to be so accepting of their situation at the beginning of the film.
It is so hard to come across fresh love stories this day and age, after everything we have seen and read... indeed, this was something utterly surprising.
We seem to have reacted very similarly to most of the film, so I'm going to focus on the section of your post where you speak of our uneasiness watching the butchering scenes. Like you, I've been thinking a lot about why it makes us so uncomfortable. You're wondering if it's the "very distant coldness" of dealing with the carcasses, "a dignity has been offended" and "something has been made lesser somehow". I think all of that is very true, and primarily because at a very elementary level we identify with the animal, a living thing one minute, a carcass the next. I think we are deeply reminded of how in death a creature immediately loses his agency. Anyone can do anything they want with the body. This complete loss of agency is horrendous to witness in an animal. It's part sympathy, part sobering facing of our own mortality. When we die, thankfully no one is going to eat us, but there are clear procedures in place, just as clinical as the butchering. If we're organ donors, bits get cut out of our bodies straight away and ferried to someone in need. If we die of unknown causes, there might be an autopsy in order. Then we are out in a freezer until it's decided what kind of funeral we'll have. Then the body needs to be prepared for the procedure. No matter how much respect people will show to the body in dealing with all this, it's going to be a well oiled clinical procedure, well practised, performed routinely.
And there is something very sad about that, because these bodies, animals or humans, were filled once with a consciousness, with life.
When Mária is going through her own procedure of distinguishing her consciousness, it's the most terrifying thing to witness. One thing to see it done to a cow, bad enough, but a person doing it to themselves, that just makes us all want to scream out loud in protest. And thank god this wasn't a story with an unhappy ending. I would have not recommended the film to you in that case. But it didn't feel like it was going there, it would have gone against the grain of the rest of the film. I remember grasping for any ideas how she might be saved, and the phone call was perfect.
The director hasn't made a feature film in near 20 years. Mz Peggy says her previous film was also wonderful. I will check if that's available anywhere online with English subtitles.
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